Mbeki on EU, Zimbabwe, and Sudan
President Thabo Mbeki's interview with SABC on the conclusion of the inaugural EU - SA Summit, Bordeaux, France July 25 2008
Interviewer: Mr, President, the inaugural Summit, EU (European Union) - SA, what is your evaluation now, first meeting, how do you think it went?
President Thabo Mbeki: Well, I think first of all, the important point to note about this, is that, it was the EU that took the initiative that we should further escalate the relations between South Africa and the European Union, and therefore proposed that we should establish this strategic partnership.
The Ministers have been meeting, this is the first time that this takes place at the Summit level, but what is clear is that the EU does indeed take SA as a very, very important partner, so you can see that in the agenda that was agreed, because in reality that agenda included not just matters of bilateral relations between South Africa and the EU, but some of the major global issues, issues like the WTO negotiations, that are going on now in Geneva, this big issue about climate change, there are other issues which we did not necessarily discuss today, but which are important like scientific research and development, issues about further developments and co-operation in areas of Information Communications and Technology.
One other issue which we did discuss today of course, was this other important question about , Migration because Europeans face movement of people, out of Africa and other parts of the world into Europe, in much the same way as we face movement of people largely from Africa but also from Asia into South Africa, so I thought it was a very open discussion and a very constructive one, it certainly enables us to influence the thinking of the EU with regard to important global matters in addition to the regular interaction that we have with them concerning bilateral relations and that also of course includes an ability to influence them with regards to the EU - AU, Africa relations, because again that is one of the matters that is on our agenda in that strategic partnership. So, I think it is an important process for us, and I will hope it is also an important process for the European Union.
Interviewer: But, there is this difficult question of the Economic Partnership Agreements (EPAs) I'm sure that this would have been raised in the meeting and is there a sense that some progress can be made on this?
Mbeki: It was raised indeed as it had to be raised and fortunately the European Council meeting earlier this year, it seems quite clear that they have understood what we said at the EU - AU Summit in Lisbon, in December (2007) and subsequently, that it was important to take a different approach, with regards to these Economic Partnership Agreements(EPAs).
So, the European Council, indeed said, it is necessary to have a look again at their approach to this. The French President had appointed one person Commission, to look into this matter and that report is out, we raised that matter, its not been discussed with a view to say what does it say but, it also supports positions that we have taken with regards to this. Pres. Sarkozy, did say that they are considering that report and indeed I think if they follow the recommendations in that report as well as decisions that have been taken by the European Council, we will indeed move quite quickly to arrive at a position which was affirmed today, that these EPAs must result in developments in the ACP(African, Caribbean and Pacific) countries and must result in Regional Integration and indeed if we then proceed look at the details of what needs to be done, then we will be able to solve the differences that have existed between ourselves and the EU.
Interviewer: President, you also touched on the WTO( World Trade Organization) happening not far from here(Geneva), did you discuss this, what are the hopes now, does it still look like there are wide differences?
Mbeki: Clearly yes, there are still differences, we are raising again the matter of proper ladder of reduction in terms of these tariffs( agricultural tariffs and agricultural support).Clearly the negotiators from the developing countries in Geneva, still feel that, there has not been enough movement , of course the EU informed us today as far as that is concerned, they believe they cant offer more than they have offered, they raised the question about our moving(developing countries) on the issue of the non- agricultural market access issues.
Fortunately, they confirmed that with regards to South Africa, they recognize the fact that SA had much earlier reduced tariffs on these industrial products and therefore it would not be fair to demand that South Africa, must do more now, so I think the matter of South Africa will really be basically solved, but that still leaves the larger question of the rest of the developing world.
So, we of course confirmed that both of us still want a speedy resolution of these matters and confirmed that, yes indeed, there has to be a balanced approach, we are not saying that there should be no reduction in terms of industrial tariffs on the part of the developing countries, but it's the degree, in much as the same way that they are not saying that there should be no reduction of tariffs in agricultural products and agricultural support, its also a matter of degree so it's basically a matter of confirmation that let us continue to remain engaged, and hopefully it might be possible for the Ministers meeting now in Geneva to find one another.
Interviewer: In a week that has been a breakthrough with regards to Zimbabwe, everybody now is in SA to try and kick-start the negotiations: What's the mood President, are you confident that the parties are ready to talk?
Mbeki: The parties are talking, our experience has been of the Zimbabwean parties that, indeed that when they do get together, they engage one other seriously. They are engaging one another seriously and the commitment they made to meet immediately after the signing of the Memorandum of Understanding, they kept to that, and that they will try to complete this process of negotiations within two weeks, they are working quite hard at that.
In our own view, they are demonstrating the will to complete this process as speedily as possible and that every body recognises the importance of moving the process forward very quickly.
Interviewer: Mr. President, How concerned are you about Sudanese President Al Bashir being indicted by the International Criminal Court (ICC), what is the AU position on this?
Mbeki: Well, I think you will have seen that, the AU Peace and Security Council have asked that the matter of serving any indictment against President Al Bashir should be held back.
We are concerned about this matter, this is a matter that we had been discussing with President Al Bashir and the government of Sudan, and indeed President Al Bashir had contacted me in the last 2 days to say that they would like to see me to discuss this matter, we will meet them, so that we can see in what ways we can respond to this.
It's a matter of serious worry, because there are two important processes that must go ahead in Sudan, one of them is the further implementation and completion of the process as visualised in the Comprehensive Peace Agreement to the North and the South and of course, the matter of Darfur.
Now, it is important that both of these processes should proceed and both of them require the very active participation of President Al Bashir and even to discuss the Darfur matter.
The Secretary General of the United Nations,( Ban Ki- Moon) as well as the Chair of the Commission of the African Union( Jean Ping) have got to interact very directly with President Al Bashir, with regard to Darfur process. I don't know how they would do that, if the ICC says here is a person that has been indicted and that they must stop interacting with him, because he is a wanted criminal. I don't know how we can implement all these matters ,it is a matter of concern, we will be talking to the government of Sudan to discuss theses matters and together with the AU, see how we can address this matter.
Thank you very much, Mr. President!
Transcript issued by The Presidency July 28 2008
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